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romney ryan were down 4 to romney biden but now they were up 12 with 44 percent with democratic side 32 percent. another key number are the voters were unsure they want somebody else. that number shot up 6 points after the debate. the debates have the potential to move the needle quite a bit. with four weeks to go joe biden has been prepping for his in delaware with chris van holland playing ryan. the president handicapped tonight's big show down. >> joe just needs to be joe. congressman ryan is a smart and effective seeker but his ideas are the wrong ones. >> ryan has a chance to let voters decide for themselves. he had ted olsen as a stand in. he is trying to shine the spos spotlight on to someone who won't be on the stage tonight, president obama. >> what i am excited about we get to offer the american people a very clear choice. joe biden has been on these big stages before. it's the my first time. he can't run away from president obama's indefensible record. >> in kentucky they will debate at center college. it will have a broad spector of foreign and domestic issues supposed to
romney ryan were down 4 to romney biden but now they were up 12 with 44 percent with democratic side 32 percent. another key number are the voters were unsure they want somebody else. that number shot up 6 points after the debate. the debates have the potential to move the needle quite a bit. with four weeks to go joe biden has been prepping for his in delaware with chris van holland playing ryan. the president handicapped tonight's big show down. >> joe just needs to be joe. congressman...
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but paul ryan said exactly what romney said. he does support abortion in cases of rape and incest. now paul ryan wants to repeal roe v. wade but still allow abortion cases of rape and incest. >> stephanie: exactly. >> and biden owned it when he said they were sending afghan troops and not american troops. laughing at your own lies is okay. laughing at the other guys' guys is rude. >> stephanie: yeah, and he just sort of disembowled this whole tax plan thing. he sounded like an eight year old, you can cut taxes by 20% -- >> sanit a cartoon once. >> stephanie: and biden is like not mathematically possible. >> and he's like you can -- biden is like it has never been done. >> no society has ever done what they are trying to do. the president is capable of this voice, but boy joe biden did a great job. >> stephanie: joe biden last night. >> when governor romney was asked about it he said we have to keep these sang -- sanctions. do you want to go to war? >> we want to prevent war. >> there is nothing more that they say we should do that we haven't already done. >> stephanie: and a lot of
but paul ryan said exactly what romney said. he does support abortion in cases of rape and incest. now paul ryan wants to repeal roe v. wade but still allow abortion cases of rape and incest. >> stephanie: exactly. >> and biden owned it when he said they were sending afghan troops and not american troops. laughing at your own lies is okay. laughing at the other guys' guys is rude. >> stephanie: yeah, and he just sort of disembowled this whole tax plan thing. he sounded like an...
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of romney-ryan and obama-biden. that's what we're debating tonight. >> why do people watch a vice presidential debate? do they watch it for a policy debate, or do they watch it to see can these guys become president of the united states? >> this stuff is always anecdotal. it's like sports. people have an opinion out of these debates. i think about it more as this month. these few weeks, the debate phase of the campaign. up until now, the entire campaign is about tv ads, surrogates arguing on televis n television, media pundits providing the analysis. and what was striking about last week's debate between governor romney and president obama, first time 90 minutes unfiltered, these two men going face to face, challenging one another. that's what this is about. it's just about suddenly we get to see the two leaders, in this case, the two vps. >> sort of philosophical. just part two of this philosophical debate. >> correct. it's the only moment in the campaign. last week 70 million viewers. this week, who knows how many
of romney-ryan and obama-biden. that's what we're debating tonight. >> why do people watch a vice presidential debate? do they watch it for a policy debate, or do they watch it to see can these guys become president of the united states? >> this stuff is always anecdotal. it's like sports. people have an opinion out of these debates. i think about it more as this month. these few weeks, the debate phase of the campaign. up until now, the entire campaign is about tv ads, surrogates...
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big jump, 4 out of 5 polls, mitt romney and paul ryan lead. have you big poll numbers in florida and virginia, showing people in just a second. abc and cbs admits the ticket is gaining ground, post debate. nbc, no, not much of an impact at ms-nbc. >> florida, ohio and virginia, battleground states. what we see on the screen, a tight, tight, dead heat in florida and in virginia. in ohio, you still see the president hanging on to a lead. i guess you could say that romney has the trend line, but ohio is still a problem. >> another factor in all three of these polls, over 90% said the debate made no difference. 6, 7 and 7% respectively who said the debates mattered to their vote. that is, not as helpful to romney as he might have hoped. >> the debate has not as much of an impact. >> sean: i was thinking that if joe biden loses and 25 day, i am thinking that nbc news -- it's a perfect place for an unhinged, over-the-top, extreme leftist. he would be perfect over there. >> chuck todd, the political director of nbc news labeled the rasmussen poll, qu
big jump, 4 out of 5 polls, mitt romney and paul ryan lead. have you big poll numbers in florida and virginia, showing people in just a second. abc and cbs admits the ticket is gaining ground, post debate. nbc, no, not much of an impact at ms-nbc. >> florida, ohio and virginia, battleground states. what we see on the screen, a tight, tight, dead heat in florida and in virginia. in ohio, you still see the president hanging on to a lead. i guess you could say that romney has the trend line,...
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the romney-ryan ticket has been spending more time in ohio than in the country. here is a little bit from governor romney at his last event. thehis president on friday the administration was to put out hasanswer to the question chas china manipulated their currency or not. they were supposed to designate that on friday. they said we will not do that. we will wait until after the election to do that. seven times so far they passed the buck on that. i'm not going to pass that off. on day one i will label china a currency manipulator and get serious about making sure that people don't cheat when it comes to trade. >> reporter: the obama administration asserted that doing such tough crackdowns on china could lead to a trade war of the fastest growing economy in the word and they said that mr. romney hasn't been entirely pure when it comes to doing business with china himself in his private life and private business experience. the romney campaign says it is all excuses and time for the u.s. government to stop putting up with china's trade practices and currency manip
the romney-ryan ticket has been spending more time in ohio than in the country. here is a little bit from governor romney at his last event. thehis president on friday the administration was to put out hasanswer to the question chas china manipulated their currency or not. they were supposed to designate that on friday. they said we will not do that. we will wait until after the election to do that. seven times so far they passed the buck on that. i'm not going to pass that off. on day one i...
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ryan has the romney plan to lower tax rates and cap deductions. do you think they're going to go at it? is it better to raise taxes or lower them to improve the economy? are we going to see that picture tonight? >> i think you will. i think you'll see a renewal of the theme if you let these individual tax rates soar up you're also clobering that small, medium-sized entrepreneur who's really a job creation engine. a quarter of all those jobs are in the hands of those folks and they're reacting negatively to the threat of higher taxes. it's one of the reasons that we've seen i think this confidence and lack of uncertainty suffer out there. in other words, people just don't know. we don't actually, larry, have a tax code really. 60 some provisions expired at the end of 2011, 40 some more are expiring this year. thog is known, nothing is certain and that's part of that big looming fiscal cliff that needs tore cleared up. paul ryan has a plan to do that. >> john harwood? >> governor engler, i just want to ask you about two economic issues. one national
ryan has the romney plan to lower tax rates and cap deductions. do you think they're going to go at it? is it better to raise taxes or lower them to improve the economy? are we going to see that picture tonight? >> i think you will. i think you'll see a renewal of the theme if you let these individual tax rates soar up you're also clobering that small, medium-sized entrepreneur who's really a job creation engine. a quarter of all those jobs are in the hands of those folks and they're...
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>> mitt romney put paul ryan on the ticket. that's not running away from the plan. >> but i mean -- he didn't embrace the ryan budget. it was too tough for him perhaps? >> correct me if i'm wrong, my understanding governor romney has been complimentary of the ryan budget plan and recognizes that we need to make reforms so that the big entitlement programs will be there for the next generation we need to tighten the belt on discreti discretionary spending. i disagree. >> mitt romney's tax proposals, because he has said that he can cut taxes without blowing up the deficit, without being deficit neutral, and at the same time keep defense spending. >> yeah. >> increase the defense budget. how does that work? >> governor romney said he can lower marginal tax rates and generate offsetting revenue so we don't increase the side of the deficit. >> how do you generate that? >> you reduce the number of write-offs and loopholes in some combinations. >> which would you reduce? he's not been specific. >> he's provided more specificity than t
>> mitt romney put paul ryan on the ticket. that's not running away from the plan. >> but i mean -- he didn't embrace the ryan budget. it was too tough for him perhaps? >> correct me if i'm wrong, my understanding governor romney has been complimentary of the ryan budget plan and recognizes that we need to make reforms so that the big entitlement programs will be there for the next generation we need to tighten the belt on discreti discretionary spending. i disagree. >>...
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certainly it's in favor of the romney-ryan ticket. why is there all of this boxing terminology going on? well, take a look at this. this is one of the posters here for sale at center college. this is being set up with a lot of boxing terminology. perhaps that's part of it. also, suzanne, i wanted to tell you a little bit about that photo that we put up there earlier. if we can show that again because that's something that only cnn has. you can only see it right here. it's an exclusive look. >> if you don't recognize the guy on the right, that is chris van holland. he is the ranking democrat. the top democrat on the house budget committee. he knows paul ryan because he is the budget chairman of that committee. you're seeing the back of the head of shayla murray. that is the communications director for the vice president. >> she's been playing martha are aedditz. the biden team went to great lengths to replicate the conditions that the vice president will face here in danville, kentucky. that table, which is a semicircle with a small ci
certainly it's in favor of the romney-ryan ticket. why is there all of this boxing terminology going on? well, take a look at this. this is one of the posters here for sale at center college. this is being set up with a lot of boxing terminology. perhaps that's part of it. also, suzanne, i wanted to tell you a little bit about that photo that we put up there earlier. if we can show that again because that's something that only cnn has. you can only see it right here. it's an exclusive look....
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or are you running and paul ryan as part of the romney/ryan ticket? how much should we expect to hear tonight about the way paul ryan comported himself in the house of representatives? >> well, you know, rachel, mitt romney and paul ryan campaigned all throughout the state of wisconsin during the republican primaries, where mitt romney completely wrapped his arms around paul ryan's policies. paul ryan's budget. i think that is going to be a piece of the discussion tonight and i think that is, you know, part of what the american people need to decide on, whether or not they want a budget that protects tax cuts for those at the top but is cutting education, and veterans and clean energy, innovation, infrastructure, turning medicare into a voucher program. those are the types of choices that the meamerican people have before them and that will be part of the discussion tonight. >> you said earlier today, stephanie, that paul ryan and mitt romney are politicizing the attack in benghazi that killed our ambassador there. the republican national committee re
or are you running and paul ryan as part of the romney/ryan ticket? how much should we expect to hear tonight about the way paul ryan comported himself in the house of representatives? >> well, you know, rachel, mitt romney and paul ryan campaigned all throughout the state of wisconsin during the republican primaries, where mitt romney completely wrapped his arms around paul ryan's policies. paul ryan's budget. i think that is going to be a piece of the discussion tonight and i think that...
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>> well, i think it's interesting that paul ryan said that if romney and ryan get elected they're not doing anything about reinstating don't ask, don't tell, which contradict what romney said during the debates, the primary and the promises he made to the gop base. i would like to see them pressed on that. you know, lgbt people we tend to see progress under democratic administrations and not a lot of regress, sometimes benign, sames malicious neglect under republican administrations. >> finally, for you, what sort of message would you extend to lgbt youth. >> coming out is not the end it's better problems. when you first come out parents react negatively. it's important to have a backup plan, line up support. 40% of homeless teenagers are lgbt kids kicked out or thrown out after they came out. if you think your family might react negatively, have a place to go, have support, have friends who have offers you a couch. >> prepare. >> prepare. don't just come out blindly. ask for your parents' love and support but have a plan, a backup plan. >> dan savage, thank you. thank you for your ti
>> well, i think it's interesting that paul ryan said that if romney and ryan get elected they're not doing anything about reinstating don't ask, don't tell, which contradict what romney said during the debates, the primary and the promises he made to the gop base. i would like to see them pressed on that. you know, lgbt people we tend to see progress under democratic administrations and not a lot of regress, sometimes benign, sames malicious neglect under republican administrations....
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the romney/ryan plan, is it politically unpopular? he has to bring that up. >> woodruff: how do you see it, mark? >> i would say with paul ryan, he's got to k k kp it going. the republicans are on a roll right now, they feel they're on a roll. but he should heed the council of robert frost to john kennedy who said be more boston and less harvard. i would say be more wisconsin more walk shaw than washington, d.c. he cannot give in words his powerpoint if he mentions sequestration oncetor committee as a whole or the motion to recommit eyes will glaze over he's got to stay on offense but at the same time he has to par tri differences between him and governor romney and especially changes that governor romney -- several incarnations that have gone to is going to parry that, not to get into the weeds but parry it. as far as joe biden, i think he's got a tougher but in many ways more simple. he's got to lift the spirits of the spirited -- dispirited democrats. i think he f he does that -- he is the happy warrior, very much so. a lot more so
the romney/ryan plan, is it politically unpopular? he has to bring that up. >> woodruff: how do you see it, mark? >> i would say with paul ryan, he's got to k k kp it going. the republicans are on a roll right now, they feel they're on a roll. but he should heed the council of robert frost to john kennedy who said be more boston and less harvard. i would say be more wisconsin more walk shaw than washington, d.c. he cannot give in words his powerpoint if he mentions sequestration...
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romney said today under duress that the romney/ryan position is the romney/ryan position, there's no difference between them. and he said you'll hear more about it at the vice presidential debate tomorrow. i bet you will. joining us now is steve kornacki, co-host of "the cycle." thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me. >> the democrats have been aggressive in driving their campaigning on this issue, because they think that's a key issue for locking up the women's vote. with this walkback, this attempted and failed walkback that happened within the last 24 hours from the romney campaign, do you think that's going to have an impact there? >> yeah. there's some interesting data that came out in the last few days which i think is what was initially behind what mitt romney said, taking a more moderate position on abortion. first you had this poll that came out in ohio, showing obama ahead of romney by four. the gender gap in this thing was astounding. among men, romney had a 16-point lead in ohio. among women, 60-38, obama. that is like a 38-point gender gap. i have not seen someth
romney said today under duress that the romney/ryan position is the romney/ryan position, there's no difference between them. and he said you'll hear more about it at the vice presidential debate tomorrow. i bet you will. joining us now is steve kornacki, co-host of "the cycle." thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me. >> the democrats have been aggressive in driving their campaigning on this issue, because they think that's a key issue for locking up the women's...
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he may have to do what romney did -- ryan may have to do what romney did. >> following the debate last week, the commission on presidential debates issued this statement, following criticism of jim lehrer's performance in the first debate. robert watson, you were quite critical of jim lehrer last week. will we see a difference this week? >> i suspect we will. if i could quickly jump on the previous comment, i think we know that joe biden and paul ryan are both tough-nosed guys who can play pretty effectively, but what is interesting is they are so completely different. when joe biden first took his seat in the senate, paul ryan was about three years old. paul ryan has to be careful about looking disrespectful to someone a lot older than him. paul ryan, as was correctly noted earlier, tends to be kind of a policy wonk. that sometimes does not resonate. it did not resonate with obama earlier. joe biden like to connect in the gut. scranton joe likes to talk to the audience. we are going to see a completely different styles. i was very critical of jim lehrer in blogs and commentary. people
he may have to do what romney did -- ryan may have to do what romney did. >> following the debate last week, the commission on presidential debates issued this statement, following criticism of jim lehrer's performance in the first debate. robert watson, you were quite critical of jim lehrer last week. will we see a difference this week? >> i suspect we will. if i could quickly jump on the previous comment, i think we know that joe biden and paul ryan are both tough-nosed guys who...
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this is where the romney ryan campaign is sort of setting up. they're doing a lot of live interviews from here on the other side of the room just doing this very quickly. the obama campaign. you can see the forward sign behind me. wolf, i had one of these behind me earlier this afternoon, we heard from the romney campaign, hey, do we have to have that sign behind you? just to show you how conscious of the optics they are even when the media is doing their live shots. >> thanks very much for that. the debate is a good reminder that the men vying for the number two job might wind up being president some day. both joe biden and paul ryan tell voters the truth. what's going on. we're going to find out more now from john berman. you've been checking the chams. what are you finding out? >> the candidates continue to war on taxes with paul ryan claiming that president obama wants not just to raise them on small businesses, but to put them over 40%. >> what president obama wants to do is raise the top tax rate on our successful small businesses and manu
this is where the romney ryan campaign is sort of setting up. they're doing a lot of live interviews from here on the other side of the room just doing this very quickly. the obama campaign. you can see the forward sign behind me. wolf, i had one of these behind me earlier this afternoon, we heard from the romney campaign, hey, do we have to have that sign behind you? just to show you how conscious of the optics they are even when the media is doing their live shots. >> thanks very much...
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gwen: and yet we've seen mitt romney and paul ryan continuing to talk about this every single day. which is interesting. because we are told that americans aren't voting on foreign policy issues. and yet here is one that won't go away. >> it's interesting also because this issue is -- is an issue that until quite recently, president obama had a huge lead against -- gwen: you were saying osama bin laden and the conversation would end. >> the polls do suggest they are chipping away at that. it's an interesting strategy, though, because as one republican strategist who's worried about it told me, when you start playing on those issues, you are playing on the commander in chief's turf. and the only time that that has ever really worked and made a difference in an election was with jimmy carter. gwen: and one of the things that joe biden was trying to do was to get back at that is to put the grinning and the smiling and the condescension was to try to say i know this guy. you can back up on this. and even on domestic issues, like the stimulus. which the republicans have always criticize
gwen: and yet we've seen mitt romney and paul ryan continuing to talk about this every single day. which is interesting. because we are told that americans aren't voting on foreign policy issues. and yet here is one that won't go away. >> it's interesting also because this issue is -- is an issue that until quite recently, president obama had a huge lead against -- gwen: you were saying osama bin laden and the conversation would end. >> the polls do suggest they are chipping away at...
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let me ask you about the romney-ryan ticket. did they establish themselves? did they pass the threshold of being presidential enough? >> yes. >> yes, i think association yes, definitely. >> i join the chorus. chris: this weekend marks the 50th anniversary of the cuban missile cry sifments president john f. kennedy and khrushchev faced each other over 13 days and much of that time they faced down the hawks on both sides, with spy plane photos showing the russians assem bling missiles in cuba capable of hitting new york, and the top advisors, including the chief of staff of the air force to authorize immediate air strikes before the missiles could be armed by the soviets. kennedy had to weigh the hawks' advice against the reality that no air strike could be 100% effective. and the possibilities that russian retaliation could target berlin and thereby trigger an all-out nuke yar war, as robert kennedy wrote, "the final list of the cuban missile crisis is the importance of placing ourselves in the other country's shoes." president kennedy understood that the sovi
let me ask you about the romney-ryan ticket. did they establish themselves? did they pass the threshold of being presidential enough? >> yes. >> yes, i think association yes, definitely. >> i join the chorus. chris: this weekend marks the 50th anniversary of the cuban missile cry sifments president john f. kennedy and khrushchev faced each other over 13 days and much of that time they faced down the hawks on both sides, with spy plane photos showing the russians assem bling...
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he needs to put their policies against romney and ryan. host: let's hear from james in missouri, an independent. everybody wants your vote. what do you think? caller: vice-president biden need to bring a calculator to the debate so that paul ryan can show us his budget. host: you think that will be one of those moments? caller: that's what needs to do. if they give enough time where he could show his budget instead of dodging the question all the time. host: you sound like you are voting for president obama. caller: yes. host: erick is a democrat in georgia. caller: every time ryan gets up there and they tried to lie, just like romney told lies the whole time he was up there. president obama needs to grill romney on a 47% comment and ask him about his opinion on abortion. and about the budget. them to what they said. every time they tell a lie, call them a lawyer. host: you sound passionate. does this debate tonight matter to you? we lost him. let's go to barbara, a republican in georgia. caller: hello. host: what do you think about tonigh
he needs to put their policies against romney and ryan. host: let's hear from james in missouri, an independent. everybody wants your vote. what do you think? caller: vice-president biden need to bring a calculator to the debate so that paul ryan can show us his budget. host: you think that will be one of those moments? caller: that's what needs to do. if they give enough time where he could show his budget instead of dodging the question all the time. host: you sound like you are voting for...
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. >> behind that group of people is romney/ryan. >> signs are always in the perfect position for the television cameras or still photographers to pick them up. >> because of how cameras work, we have something here like 40, 50-foot banners cover buildings and get in a tight shot. >> it's the first thing he walks past that people say as he makes the pivot toward the stage. >> what difference does it make? >> visuals matter so much. campaigns come down to photography. campaigns need light and sound. >> ladies and gentlemen, please welcome the next president of the united states! >> keep it up, keep it up. >> now kill it, kill it. >> if we fail, the message stays here with 2,000 or 3,000 people in cleveland, ohio. the goal is to make sure it translates to as many folks as possible. >> ritter monitors the events as they happen. >> hey, will, you're live on all the cables. can i get more hand signs to that crowd behind the gov? >> setting up one event may take weeks and yet -- >> it may last ten minutes. >> then they do it again. 1:00, 2:00 in the morning, we'll do it again. it heads to t
. >> behind that group of people is romney/ryan. >> signs are always in the perfect position for the television cameras or still photographers to pick them up. >> because of how cameras work, we have something here like 40, 50-foot banners cover buildings and get in a tight shot. >> it's the first thing he walks past that people say as he makes the pivot toward the stage. >> what difference does it make? >> visuals matter so much. campaigns come down to...
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you had paul ryan embracing the across the board tax cut mitt romney is running on. he was pressed by martha, who did an excellent job exactly specifically you do to pay for that tax cut, totally evaded that. what happened was as happened on other issues, joe biden got frustrated. you saw biden, he variously was laughing, smiling, got angry at times. i think there were times at which that demeanor did not serve him well. ryan did not get flustered. did have some republican political strategists who i talked to during the debate thought ryan looked a little bit smug at times. ryan, of course, is young, he has to worry about looking like the junior varsity against the older guy. bottom line, i don't think anybody dominated the debate but i thought ryan did well and i think basically what we've done is set the table for the debate next week with obama and romney. that is going to determine what the next pivot in this race is. >> john, just to bring up a couple of points. we did have an informal poll on cnbc, about 3,000 people wrote in, based on what they have been writ
you had paul ryan embracing the across the board tax cut mitt romney is running on. he was pressed by martha, who did an excellent job exactly specifically you do to pay for that tax cut, totally evaded that. what happened was as happened on other issues, joe biden got frustrated. you saw biden, he variously was laughing, smiling, got angry at times. i think there were times at which that demeanor did not serve him well. ryan did not get flustered. did have some republican political strategists...
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. >> the first two debates were paul ryan, mitt romney. the numbers that i have have shown a significant movement in the senior vote, but we're also, you know -- look, since 1952 dwight eisenhower there have been 15 presidential elections. democrats have won four. each one of those four johnson, carter, clinton, and obama have been won by people who eventually won the election. in florida he is behind. i mean, obama. if he is behind in florida, according to florida history, he is not going to win the general election. >> let's get this straight on medicare. the $700 billion plus that al and other republicans speak about coming out of medicare just so all of florida seniors knows, that's coming out of insurance companies and providers who are charging too much. >> providers are -- but, okay, let me just -- i don't want to get into the weeds on this number because nobody ever comes to an agreement on it, but a provider is a doctor, and what we know is that those folks on medicare have to struggle sometimes to find a doctor who will accept me
. >> the first two debates were paul ryan, mitt romney. the numbers that i have have shown a significant movement in the senior vote, but we're also, you know -- look, since 1952 dwight eisenhower there have been 15 presidential elections. democrats have won four. each one of those four johnson, carter, clinton, and obama have been won by people who eventually won the election. in florida he is behind. i mean, obama. if he is behind in florida, according to florida history, he is not...
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the idea in general is to tie governor mitt romney -- sorry, tie governor romney to the ryan budget. and as one top democrat put it to me, the idea is to make the case that romney/ryan in electing that ticket means americans would be electing the intellectual leader of the house republicans, as one person put it, that paul ryan is the intellectual leader of the house republicans and he should not be able tonight to duck from any specifics. so, again, we will hear that word, specifics. and look for the vice president to try to get paul ryan to talk about budget details in this debate tonight, wolf. >> jessica, has the vice president done his tour of the actual debate hall yet? >> reporter: he has. he did that tour a little earlier today before 2:00 p.m. he sat in the chair. he looked at the monitor where you get your time cues. and i'm told all that went smoothly. he also before he boarded the plane today leaving from delaware he talked to reporters and he was asked what is his strategy. take a listen to what he said. >> i'm looking forward to it. nice of you guys to be here. are you
the idea in general is to tie governor mitt romney -- sorry, tie governor romney to the ryan budget. and as one top democrat put it to me, the idea is to make the case that romney/ryan in electing that ticket means americans would be electing the intellectual leader of the house republicans, as one person put it, that paul ryan is the intellectual leader of the house republicans and he should not be able tonight to duck from any specifics. so, again, we will hear that word, specifics. and look...